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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
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artists, authors and so on across the internet are often confused about just what copyright is and if they are protected or not. obviously, we are concerned with this right now with the Eula proposed changes. i thought i'd point out, by quotes from the actual united states copyright internet site, some of the laws and have a little debate/discussion about all this, separate from the Eula thread. perhaps this will clear up some folk's ideas of just what is law and what is myth about copyrights. the following is a quote from this page of the u.s. copyright site: http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html

and the first quote i wanted to post is this:

Quote
What Works Are Protected?
Copyright protects “original works of authorship” that are fixed in a tangible form of expression. The fixation need not be directly perceptible so long as it may be communicated with the aid of a machine or device. Copyrightable works include the following categories:

literary works;
musical works, including any accompanying words
dramatic works, including any accompanying music
pantomimes and choreographic works
pictorial, graphic, and sculptural works
motion pictures and other audiovisual works
sound recordings
architectural works
These categories should be viewed broadly. For example, computer programs and most “compilations” may be registered as “literary works”; maps and architectural plans may be registered as “pictorial, graphic, and sculptural works.”


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What Is Not Protected by Copyright?
Several categories of material are generally not eligible for federal copyright protection. These include among others:

Works that have not been fixed in a tangible form of expression (for example, choreographic works that have not been notated or recorded, or improvisational speeches or performances that have not been written or recorded)

Titles, names, short phrases, and slogans; familiar symbols or designs; mere variations of typographic ornamentation, lettering, or coloring; mere listings of ingredients or contents

Ideas, procedures, methods, systems, processes, concepts, principles, discoveries, or devices, as distinguished from a description, explanation, or illustration

Works consisting entirely of information that is common property and containing no original authorship (for example: standard calendars, height and weight charts, tape measures and rulers, and lists or tables taken from public documents or other common sources)


notice specifically the use of the term 'tangible'.
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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StevieJ
Designer/Artist

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Quote
Kraellin wrote:
notice specifically the use of the term 'tangible'.

Yeah.....and that's exactly what the new EULA will do.....give authors "tangible" copyrights.....

Good post!!! smile:)
Steve

"Buzzards gotta eat...same as worms..." - Clint :)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
well, when i pointed out 'tangible', i was trying to point out that presets are in a tangible form. the filter itself is in a tangible form, but anything not yet rendered by a given filter is NOT in a tangible form yet. and i would therefore assume that all presets are already copyrighted by the authors. therefore, their presets of their filters would need no further copyright protection.
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
here's another one that is often misunderstood. this is taken from the same page as the last one:

Quote
Copyright Registration
In general, copyright registration is a legal formality intended to make a public record of the basic facts of a particular copyright. However, registration is not a condition of copyright protection. Even though registration is not a requirement for protection, the copyright law provides several inducements or advantages to encourage copyright owners to make registration. Among these advantages are the following:

Registration establishes a public record of the copyright claim.
Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U.S. origin.


notice very carefully the last line here!

and here it is again, this time from a different page off the u.s. copyright site: http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq...l#register

Quote
Do I have to register with your office to be protected?
No. In general, registration is voluntary. Copyright exists from the moment the work is created. You will have to register, however, if you wish to bring a lawsuit for infringement of a U.S. work.
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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StevieJ
Designer/Artist

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Yeah, but with no current user restrictions, making authors the licensors and copyright holders doesn't mean anything at all.....because FF takes any and all copyright protection away on the user end......
Steve

"Buzzards gotta eat...same as worms..." - Clint :)
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Conniekat8
Filtereurotic
Posts: 351
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Quote
Kraellin wrote:
well, when i pointed out 'tangible', i was trying to point out that presets are in a tangible form. the filter itself is in a tangible form, but anything not yet rendered by a given filter is NOT in a tangible form yet. and i would therefore assume that all presets are already copyrighted by the authors. therefore, their presets of their filters would need no further copyright protection.


Assumed or not, without it being more clearly defined in the EULA, various online marketplaces don't see texture sellers in violation of copyrights or EULA if they sell images made from presets. Without change in definition, filter authors don't have a leg to stand on if they wish to ask people to stop selling their textures.

They can attempt to argue it, BUT, the whole point of EULA change is to not have to fight and argue about it.

For example, in one of the cases of texture sales on renderosity, renderosity's response was that they were in communication with FF, and that the official word from FF is that selling textures made from presets was not a violation.

Once that happens, it doesn't matter how you or I or saint Peter thinks how this should be interpreted. Sure, one may want to try to go to court, but your average filter maker probably has no desire or resources to do that. End of story.
Fiter makers need more protection at this level, and EULA does that.

A change in EULA wording clears it all up. Filter maker sees someone selling images from their presets, and doesn't like it... he has the basis that noone can easily dispute to sey, hey, you need to stop that.

Look at the above scenario if proposed EULA changes were in effect:
Renderosity contacts FF and asks if it's a violation of EULA. FF says, yes, selling unbodified textures made from presets IS against EULA. End of story.
No need for attorneys lawsuits or personal interpretations of copyright law details.
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
Quote
Conniekat8 wrote:
Assumed or not, without it being more clearly defined in the EULA, various online marketplaces don't see texture sellers in violation of copyrights or EULA if they sell images made from presets. Without change in definition, filter authors don't have a leg to stand on if they wish to ask people to stop selling their textures.


i would think that's correct. the only thing this points out is that the resellers cant claim copyrights themselves on the presets. they can use them, resell them and so on, but they cant display a copyright notice on the preset renderings. that's all.

Quote
Conniekat8 wrote:
For example, in one of the cases of texture sales on renderosity, renderosity's response was that they were in communication with FF, and that the official word from FF is that selling textures made from presets was not a violation.


that's also correct.
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
ah, i found the 'poor man's copyright' i was talking about in another thread. it's on this page: http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq...ml#poorman and reads thusly:

Quote
I’ve heard about a “poor man’s copyright.” What is it?
The practice of sending a copy of your own work to yourself is sometimes called a “poor man’s copyright.” There is no provision in the copyright law regarding any such type of protection, and it is not a substitute for registration.


If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
and since 'derivative works' are somewhat important to us right now, here's a couple quotes. this is from the following page: http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92ch...derivative and reads:

Quote
A “derivative work” is a work based upon one or more preexisting works, such as a translation, musical arrangement, dramatization, fictionalization, motion picture version, sound recording, art reproduction, abridgment, condensation, or any other form in which a work may be recast, transformed, or adapted. A work consisting of editorial revisions, annotations, elaborations, or other modifications, which, as a whole, represent an original work of authorship, is a “derivative work”.


and from this page: http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ14.html we find this:

Quote
Derivative Works
A “derivative work,” that is, a work that is based on (or derived from) one or more already existing works, is copyrightable if it includes what the copyright law calls an “original work of authorship.” Derivative works, also known as “new versions,” include such works as translations, musical arrangements, dramatizations, fictionalizations, art reproductions, and condensations. Any work in which the editorial revisions, annotations, elaborations, or other modifications represent, as a whole, an original work of authorship is a derivative work or new version.


and the question of who may prepare a derivative work is answered on this page: http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ14.html and states:

Quote
Who May Prepare a Derivative Work?
Only the owner of copyright in a work has the right to prepare, or to authorize someone else to create, a new version of that work. The owner is generally the author or someone who has obtained rights from the author.

If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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